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    The Dangers of Wrong Meditation Practices

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    Sanicle

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    The Dangers of Wrong Meditation Practices

    Post  Sanicle on Sat Aug 09, 2014 5:08 pm

    This thread was begun to make readers aware of the potential problems that can occur in our physical (in particular), emotional and mental bodies, due to practicing meditation………….dangers which are not often spelled out by those who recommend the practice and, as such, many seem unaware of, as was I. The thread is NOT intended to delve into what (or who) may come through to us from other sources from participating in any of the various forms of this practice. There are plenty of threads and info on the net that discuss this already.


    I've started this thread because reading the material I'm going to post links to have given an answer to why a health issue I've had for years now - that of vertigo or dizziness - has suddenly disappeared, so naturally I'm hoping this information I've found may help others with this or other problems that are listed below that can occur from wrong meditation practices.  You see I stopped meditating for some weeks and vaguely noticed that I hadn't been having so many dizzy spells, but the other night I did a healing meditation for another health issue I've developed.  During this meditation I suddenly had quite a strong episode of vertigo again so it was easy enough to put two and two together.  I got googling and came up with not only the reason behind the most outward expression of the vertigo spells but further reading revealed the underlying issue that allowed that to occur.

    The first clue ...........
    It is very possible for a person to have such a good meditation that the physical body becomes disconnected for the astral-, mental-, or soul-level bodies. This is a common byproduct of meditation. If you feel dizzy, lightheaded, disconnected, or experience a rocking motion during or after meditation, you may have started the process of out-of-the-body travel.

    There are other problems listed at this website also, but they don't tell you how to 'fix' these issues.  Plus I don't see vertigo as a desirable effect of meditating, especially when it occurs when one in not meditating as well.  Read more here: http://www.dailyom.com/library/000/000/000000260.html

    Another website revealed why it is that I would have such a weak link between my physical and etheric bodies, the underlying cause.  I was already aware what I learned might be an issue but now I know it is.  You've probably guessed also .......... weak lower chakras, not well grounded.

    So that's my issue explained but there are further problems that can be experienced listed below.


       Dizziness or loss of balance
       Spontaneous urges to move or take unusual postures or positions
       Localized pain that begins and ends abruptly with no external cause
       Abrupt changes in heart rate, including tachycardia (rapid heart rate), and bradycardia (slow heart rate), and other kinds of heart arrhythmia
       Unusually abrupt and intense sexual sensations, pains, and urges
       Temporary blindness
       Uticaria and rashes
       Allergies
       Anxiety attacks
       Confusion
       Intense emotions, particularly intense emotional swings
       Psychotic symptoms, including ideation
       Spontaneous speeding and slowing of thoughts
       Spontaneous trance states, where awareness of external surroundings and conscious control are very limited
       Unwanted and uncontrolled paranormal experiences such as psychic or clairvoyant activity
       Suicidal and homicidal thoughts
       Urges to self-mutilate
       Inability to talk
       Difficulty concentrating
       Insomnia
       A sense of one’s own thoughts and emotions being foreign and invasive.

    As can be seen, some of these are far more serious.  The good thing is that a .pdf is attached that goes into more detail and also explain how these problems can be overcome.  I'm giving the link to the introduction page as the questions by readers and answers given below are well worth reading.  That link is: http://www.iam-u.org/index.php/how-to-avoid-the-dangers-of-meditation

    The link to the most helpful .pdf is http://iam-u.org/media/kundalini_syndrome.pdf   It is 25 pages long, but in reality it's more like 25 paragraphs as the pages are quite short.

    Hopefully someone out there will find this info as useful as I have.   I love you


    Last edited by Sanicle on Wed Aug 13, 2014 6:33 am; edited 1 time in total
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    orthodoxymoron

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    Re: The Dangers of Wrong Meditation Practices

    Post  orthodoxymoron on Sun Aug 10, 2014 8:09 am

    I'm a bit old-fashioned and paranoid BUT I think there are good and evil unseen-entities who we come closer to during meditation. I research rather than meditate -- but I feel as though I'm in some sort of a nasty spiritual-war 24/7. I guess I lean toward research, music, and nature -- rather than prayer or meditation -- but I seem to be a mess -- so perhaps I've gotten it wrong.
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    mudra

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    Re: The Dangers of Wrong Meditation Practices

    Post  mudra on Sun Aug 10, 2014 5:44 pm

    You are not saying exactly what you did wrong with your meditation Sanicle.
    But here is a very good video that one of our members Matt Presti created recently
    in which he explains some of the misconceptions people may have about meditation
    as well as what meditation actually is.

    Knowing The Creator 101 - Episode Two - Meditation & Prayer

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-jj9R4oSs0g


    Love Always
    mudra
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    orthodoxymoron

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    Re: The Dangers of Wrong Meditation Practices

    Post  orthodoxymoron on Mon Aug 11, 2014 10:30 am

    Meditation usually involves "emptying one's mind" -- right??

    Prayer usually involves "begging God for something" -- right??

    Research usually involves "filling one's mind with something of substance" -- right??

    Think about it.
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    Brook

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    Re: The Dangers of Wrong Meditation Practices

    Post  Brook on Mon Aug 11, 2014 10:42 am

    Wrong....

    Meditation is Opening the mind

    (Imagine me trying to empty my mind...LOL)

    Research is filling the mind with second hand information if it is derived from someone else.

    Prayer....Well prayer is different things to different people...depending upon the prayer.  It certainly is NOT always begging God for whatever....

    example: Praise be to God....

    For that glorious cup of

     Brook 

     cheers 



    ~

    Here's some second hand informational research on Meditation

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meditation

    http://www.mayoclinic.org/tests-procedures/meditation/in-depth/meditation/art-20045858

    ~

    May as well add some second hand informational research on the benefits of coffee...LOL

    http://www.webmd.com/food-recipes/features/coffee-new-health-food





    Now I have more to say on the OP post...but I have to take my coffee to go and get to work...Later!

     Enlightened 
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    mudra

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    Re: The Dangers of Wrong Meditation Practices

    Post  mudra on Mon Aug 11, 2014 11:48 am

    Brook wrote:[center][b]Wrong....

    Meditation is Opening the mind

    (Imagine me trying to empty my mind...LOL)

    Research is filling the mind with second hand information if it is derived from someone else.

    Prayer....Well prayer is different things to different people...depending upon the prayer.  It certainly is NOT always begging God for whatever....

    example: Praise be to God....

    For that glorious cup of

     Brook 


    I would quite agree with that Brook.

    Meditation from personal experience is that perspective one takes that brings you to the awareness of presence of Being. It has everything to do with Being in the Now allowing for a greater panorama .And yes one could say indeed an opening of the mind or a freeing of the mind's bolts .

    Sucessful meditation puts you in a state of " knowing " which is different from research that fills the mind with " knowledge ".

    Research without the knowing one gains from presence of Being is useful and very practical at times but one must realize that the invaluable Conscious presence of Being won't be found in any book no matter how much the information it contains is pertinent.

    As far as prayer is concerned I am not very knowledgeable in that subject matter.
    When I wish someone or something a good or better outcome I hold them in my Heart .

    Love from me
    mudra
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    Sanicle

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    Re: The Dangers of Wrong Meditation Practices

    Post  Sanicle on Mon Aug 11, 2014 2:07 pm

    mudra wrote: You are not saying exactly what you did wrong with your meditation Sanicle.
    I guess not my friend and I’m still not really sure, but that’s the point really.  I believe that my problem was caused because my lower chakras were weak when I began meditating. Why do I think this? Because I've had no great interest in any of the things the lower chakras deal with and haven't done for the past forty years. There is other evidence of this weakness also. I also believe that I called in did more to stimulate the higher ones than the lower ones, creating an even more imbalanced state.  Or it may simply be that I was unaware that when meditating laying down that a pillow shouldn’t be used.  I hadn’t heard or read that before and maybe using one created a blockage of some sort.

    The warning here as I see it is that unless we ourselves, or a teacher, can see (ie clairvoyantly) exactly what state our chakras and energy flows are in before we begin meditating we run the risk of taking a course that may prove to be dangerous to our health and well-being, as I obviously did.  There truly are some horror stories out there and I should add those to this thread as a warning also.

    IMO now, if it can be seen that we are out of balance or blocked to begin with in any chakras and those imbalances aren’t dealt with, or specific meditative practices aren’t given to accommodate and correct the imbalance by a knowledgeable teacher, we can risk becoming even more out of balance until those problems manifest physically, emotionally or mentally.   I also think it would be wise to have this seer monitor our progress as we go as well at an energetic level to redress any new issues that may occur.

    We all know that meditation is a very powerful tool for altering the energy flows in our bodies, minds and emotions, for great good if done correctly, obviously.  But as with any other powerful tool, if misused great harm can be done as well.  It truly isn't something to play around with, just following some method read on the Internet or even following some well meaning teacher who doesn't know the ins and outs of your being.  What may have worked well for him or her may not work for you.  There are so many different methods out there and courses are not always run for the most altruistic reasons.  We may not all have the wisdom to know which one is best for us at a particular point in time.


    Last edited by Sanicle on Mon Aug 11, 2014 2:43 pm; edited 1 time in total
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    Sanicle

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    Re: The Dangers of Wrong Meditation Practices

    Post  Sanicle on Mon Aug 11, 2014 2:14 pm

    Here's a few excerpt from a page about the dangers of Transcendental Meditation.

    They didn't tell you at the introductory lectures that unpleasant things may result from the practice of TM? This was yet another mental reservation "for your own good." They didn't want to scare you off which would keep you from gaining the "benefits" of TM. They meant well.

    But this is the point at which some people do indeed began to experience significant negative effects from the practice of TM. This is because all of this dissociation turns out not to be a normal or "natural" thing at all.

    These negative effects can take the form of lingering dissociation after meditation, or after coming home from a residence course. You may have trouble getting out of that "spacey" condition. In fact, as you increase your TM dosage and frequency you may reach a stage where you never get out of the "spacey" state at all, i.e. you may experience chronic dissociation. Chronic dissociation is the most dangerous effect of TM, and can become very very serious.

    TM can also actually significantly increase anxiety in some people. This is a well-known phenomenon called "relaxation induced anxiety."

    Another very common negative effect is to have "headaches in meditation". This can happen even doing just "twenty minutes twice a day", but it is especially common during and after periods of toxically increased "dissociation dosage" such as at a residence course.

    The negative effects can also take the form of unpleasant physical sensations or involuntary twitching of large muscle groups.

    On a long course, such as a Teacher Training Course (TTC), "heavy unstressing" is a major fact of life for many people. My TTC was the "Mallorca/Fiuggi Fonte Course" in the early 70's. It is infamous for the "heavy unstressing" that went on.

    At one point we were "rounding" for 14 hours a day! A "round" is a period of meditation followed by a period of yoga postures or "asanas." Meditation, asanas, meditation, asanas, etc. etc. etc. for 14 hours a day, day after day. At other points in the course we rounded fewer hours a day which gave us time for hours and hours of indoctrination sessions. This went on for a minimum of three months for everyone, but there were people like me there for six months and even longer doing this.

    It was very common for people to acquire major tics of large muscle groups, most commonly in the form of very noticeable head jerks. I'm talking about sudden jerks of the head to right or left of about 45 degrees. In addition there were people with major emotional problems. Mahesh had to establish "heavy unstressing clinics." At attempt was made to help people at these clinics by application of physical therapies including body massage and foot massage.

    Several people were not able to become TM teachers at this course because they were not able to free themselves of the major body tics before it was time to "receive their mantras." Mahesh could not send people back to their communities as official "Exponents of Reality" when they had been so conspicuously damaged by the TTC experience.

    There was a great deal of psychological suffering. One course participant went home and was hospitalized for mental difficulties by his father, a psychiatrist. Mahesh was quite disturbed by this event (he particularly wanted the endorsement of psychiatrists) and he discussed this negative turn of events in an open meeting. He was angry that such a "weak person" had been allowed to come to the TTC. He showed no concern about the person involved. At all.

    It gets worse. More can be read here: http://www.suggestibility.org/surprise.php
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    Re: The Dangers of Wrong Meditation Practices

    Post  Sanicle on Mon Aug 11, 2014 2:27 pm

    Here's another list, this time about problems that can occur from "Mindfulness Meditation"......... "being aware in the present moment".

    17 Ways mindfulness meditation can cause you emotional harm

    Mindfulness meditation is about clinging to the story: Emotions aren’t real. Aren’t accurate. Will pass.

    When you dissociate from your negative emotions, an integral part of who you are, seventeen of many unintended negative consequences may result:

    You start to judge uncomfortable thoughts and feelings as inferior, unreal, or bad. Which gets in your way of actually learning from them, experiencing and healing them, growing from them, and integrating them.

    You get good at stuffing anger and other negative emotions. Which might make them go away — temporarily. But hasn’t shown to be very effective.

    If and when a traumatic or emotionally painful experience occurs, you don’t fully process it, and cut your grieving process dangerously short.

    You have low tolerance for processing grief. So if you start to remember something traumatic, you stuff it down, potentially re-traumatizing yourself.

    You expect meditation to fix your problems for you, resolve your relationship conflicts, and make you happy. Each of those things requires hard work, commitment, and realistically, some discomfort. When you look to meditation to save you, you stop putting in the hard work and commitment, and evade the discomfort. Which makes it harder to effectively work toward your goals.

    You detach yourself from conflicts in your life, expecting that meditation will get rid of the negative emotions — and fix the problem altogether. The emotions just signal the problem. Even if you ignore the emotions, the problem is still there.

    You detach from your partner or loved one when they’re upset or experiencing an emotion you see as undesirable. You wish they’d just meditate it away, calm down, take a walk, get a grip — do whatever it takes to get rid of the emotion. When you invalidate your partner’s negative emotions, you cause serious wounds to both of you, harming trust and intimacy.

    You find it difficult to connect to your feelings when you want to be emotionally honest with yourself and others. Because you’ve trained yourself to avoid them. This impairs your ability to be emotionally intimate with anyone.

    Your relationships deteriorate, because you lose touch with what interpersonal conflict really means. After all, no one is really experiencing hurt feelings, right? Those feelings aren’t really real; just dissociate from them. Or, “observe” them.

    You struggle to empathize with others, or understand their pain. If you don’t feel your own pain — you can’t expect to have compassion for another’s pain.

    You lose your ability to naturally feel upset, sad, or concerned when there’s an issue in your life that you need to address. This puts a damper on healthy discernment.

    Your ability to feel positive emotions is also affected. Because you don’t allow experience of the negative. The positive cannot exist without the negative. Get rid of the negative, the positive has no meaning.

    Your passion and drive in life start to fade, or shift away from those things that are truly special to you. Which may be a good thing, if you don’t want to cling to such things. But a bad thing if you give up pursuits that once gave you meaning and reward.

    You start to feel dissatisfied with your life, and alone. But because of the nature of mindfulness meditation, you compound the problem by meditating, dissociating, and numbing even more.

    You become fixated, obsessed, attached to abstract, man-made, escapist concepts like enlightenment and transcendence. This distracts you from attending to your actual life, here on Earth, as a mortal human being.

    You subconsciously seek a guru or teacher to show you the way to “better” enlightenment and transcendence. You have no idea how this person deals with their interpersonal relationships, not to mention conflict. You have no idea if this person could manage the mundane responsibilities you struggle to balance in life. Yet you put this person on a pedestal, and potentially take a advice that’s really not suited for your lifestyle.

    You get it in your head that humans are so imperfect. This may come from the spiritual beliefs surrounding the practice, or just hanging around others who practice. (“Perfect” is a human construct by the way.) You then judge your human-ness. And seek to quiet (or kill) your ego, or self concept. Which puts you in ultimate conflict with yourself.

    Source: http://mindfulconstruct.com/2011/02/04/17-ways-mindfulness-meditation-can-cause-you-emotional-harm/

    Granted, some of these examples at the above websites may be extreme cases, but I think those who meditate and those who are considering taking up meditation should be aware of them.   Oh and I'm looking forward to what you have to say on the matter Brook.  Cheerful  Also anything you may wish to add Mudra. I love you

    (PS Sorry, I should have posted this thread on the Meditation and Yoga thread. My mistake. But too late to change it now as I was going to.  Embarassed )
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    mudra

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    Re: The Dangers of Wrong Meditation Practices

    Post  mudra on Mon Aug 11, 2014 4:06 pm

    [quote="Sanicle"]
    mudra wrote:
    We all know that meditation is a very powerful tool for altering the energy flows in our bodies, minds and emotions, for great good if done correctly, obviously.  But as with any other powerful tool, if misused great harm can be done as well.  It truly isn't something to play around with, just following some method read on the Internet or even following some well meaning teacher who doesn't know the ins and outs of your being.  What may have worked well for him or her may not work for you.  There are so many different methods out there and courses are not always run for the most altruistic reasons.  We may not all have the wisdom to know which one is best for us at a particular point in time.

    Thank You Sanicle for your thoughts about how your particular way to meditate went wrong for you. I understand.

    It is true there are many different methods of meditation available  on the market.
    Many of them will lend on the shore of your mind but very few will stand out and hit you right into the Heart.
    That's the one to go for for that's the one that you will be able to work with in an harmonious way.

    And we speak of meditation here but it could be any other thing . It could be Art, it could be music , it could be gardening , it could be contemplation ... For what it is all about is that pathless path to the awareness of who you really are, that timeless place where your eyes are rooted.

    That thing hits you in the Heart and you know grace has opened up for you and you enter there with heart and soul. One could say Heart and soul bring you to that threshold. Its inspiration guiding you , the compass of Know/Now and it  transforms your perceptions with great love , no harm.

    There are many fruits in the garden so that all can be fed but not everyone will eat the same. The plum will create indigestion for some while being a nectar for others. We can share our experiences but everyone has to make his own.
    And before we really find the Heart we stumble on the road exploring all that it is not.  But because the Heart is a gift that watches over everyone of us soon or later we get back on our feet and the experience changes.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x15cC8NnjgU


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    orthodoxymoron

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    Re: The Dangers of Wrong Meditation Practices

    Post  orthodoxymoron on Mon Aug 11, 2014 10:40 pm

    I choose to research -- for better or worse -- till death opens my mind to new horizons (or whatever). It is my way of 'meditating and praying' -- but what do I know?? It seems as if I'm always wrong. I guess we all have our crosses to bear. I've frankly been extremely disappointed with those who are involved in a lot of esoteric mental and spiritual practices. That's all I'm going to say.
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    Sanicle

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    Re: The Dangers of Wrong Meditation Practices

    Post  Sanicle on Tue Aug 12, 2014 6:42 am

    mudra wrote:That thing hits you in the Heart and you know grace has opened up for you and you enter there with heart and soul. One could say Heart and soul bring you to that threshold. Its inspiration guiding you , the compass of Know/Now and it transforms your perceptions with great love , no harm.

    I agree with you Mudra and I'm not saying here that meditation is something we shouldn't do. I followed my heart in meditating and doing so made my life far, far richer than I'm sure it would have been otherwise. The lessons I learned about myself were more emphatically bought home to me by delving into this rich landscape and meeting the beings I did there and thus doing things to learn the truth of them that can't be done here. I do not regret any of it. Far from it.

    And now not meditating has taught me something else about life in these bodies of ours that I probably wouldn't have discovered otherwise.........just how powerfully it can effect us in ways that we are generally not made aware of by those in this 'business'. And I truly think these warnings need to be taken heed of so that people can make more discerning decisions than I, for one, made when I began the practice. You could almost say that being aware of these effects just go to prove how powerful the practice truly is.  I love you 
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    Sanicle

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    Re: The Dangers of Wrong Meditation Practices

    Post  Sanicle on Tue Aug 12, 2014 6:49 am

    orthodoxymoron wrote:I choose to research -- for better or worse -- till death opens my mind to new horizons (or whatever). It is my way of 'meditating and praying' -- but what do I know?? It seems as if I'm always wrong. I guess we all have our crosses to bear. I've frankly been extremely disappointed with those who are involved in a lot of esoteric mental and spiritual practices. That's all I'm going to say.

    I truly don't know why you don't do what you do with a calm heart and mind Oxy. You have every right to live your life and do what feels right to you, the same as we all do. Has anyone ever insisted you do otherwise? IMO you are the only one beating yourself up over what you choose to do, regardless of how you are interpreting other peoples' differences of opinion to your own ie as meaning you are somehow "wrong" in how you conduct your life. Why don't you enjoy the differences and celebrate the fact that we are all given the space and freedom to be so and share them with others on forums like this.  Hugs 
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    Brook

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    Re: The Dangers of Wrong Meditation Practices

    Post  Brook on Tue Aug 12, 2014 10:57 am

    Oh man...ODM...why do you take what I said is such a somber way.  I even tried to make it lighthearted.

    But yes....you made some wrong presumptions.  And yet again you make wrong presumptions:

    "I've frankly been extremely disappointed with those who are involved in a lot of esoteric mental and spiritual practices".

    Just like the assumption that prayer is begging for something.  It's not can we at least agree on that?  Giving thanks to some unseen force such as the concept of God is one.

    It's often giving thanks to this unseen force that seems to step in at times when you least expect it and create miracles.  Problem is so few experience this hence the "extreme disappointment"?

    Let me tell you something ODM....NOBODY could have been MORE DISAPPOINTED than I when my son died from a stupid "accident".  

    But through that practice you mistakenly think "empties the mind"..I gained some REAL revelations.  OF course it does not bring my son back but it certainly has shown me there is far more than this meager existence to look forward to.  In fact I realized this quite some time before he died.  But the things that came to light after he died once again showed me there is far more....far more than anything we with our simple researching brains can comprehend.  A great deal of that comprehension deals with "perception".


    Perception (from the Latin perceptio, percipio) is the organization, identification, and interpretation of sensory information in order to represent and understand the environment.


    Something I'VE BEEN RESEARCHING for quite some time.  That would be the perceptions I've gained it the practice of opening my mind.  You want to know something ODM?  I keep learning new things EVERYDAY!

    Why is that?

    Because I've learned to open my mind!

    A whole lot of the research I've done very much connects academic DATA to the "Beyond" Physics...better known as Metaphysics.  Practiced often through a form of meditation.  Some of the things I've stumbled upon researching the subject are mind blowing!  

    So sure go right ahead and put down a practice you've barley scratched the surface of as a non practicing voyeur.  BUT...Please do pass judgement... everyone seems have an opinion.  Especially those who don't have a clue what it entails.  Particularly when it comes to perceptions and the pitfalls of that.

    Most people give up after a spell, or say reaching a particular level because it requires a great deal of fortitude and work.  Were you aware of that?  Probably not.

    Oh how many time have you said to my posts...I'll watch that later.  With no recognizable response afterward?  Did you watch or simply reject it?  Absolutely NO RESPONSE!



    Silly me!  Waiting for a response!

    While you toy with the ideas ODM I've been corresponding with some rather famous researchers on the tunnels under the Spinx.  Regarding the Schor Expedition from 1995-'97 which got halted by Hawass.  Yet there is a  personal friend I have that MADE a video inside one of those shafts.  VERY recognizable. Discovered and dated long before the Hawass discovery.  When he stepped in ....made the news ...the coffin was "empty".  Described by Hawass as simply a representing effigy in honor.  Right!!!!!!!!!  A six ton coffin is taken with quite difficulty from the top to the deeply buried tunnel for effigy and left empty.  Now does that REALLY Make sense?  Not only that....it completely got halted to the public as to any finding beyond the tomb.  And on both accounts...they clearly show tunnels beyond the tomb. Now I think I've lit another fire under their butts because they missed the dating of the expedition and that means a whole lot!

    Not only that ODM... I research all REALMS of information to gain understanding of various subjects.  Particularly Physics and science.

    Now ODM...this is called research.  

    But my friend you can research AND open your mind at the same time!

    Imagine that!



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    mudra

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    Re: The Dangers of Wrong Meditation Practices

    Post  mudra on Tue Aug 12, 2014 1:30 pm

    orthodoxymoron wrote:I choose to research -- for better or worse -- till death opens my mind to new horizons (or whatever). It is my way of 'meditating and praying' -- but what do I know?? It seems as if I'm always wrong. I guess we all have our crosses to bear. I've frankly been extremely disappointed with those who are involved in a lot of esoteric mental and spiritual practices. That's all I'm going to say.

    Why wait death for opening the mind Oxy ? This can be done while living life as we do it now for here is the I Am that we are. This can be done in parallel to researching. Doing otherwise it's like putting ourselves on standby with a lid on inner eye/ I does'nt it ?

    It's part of life to be disappointed by others at times for not all of us are on the same page at the same time.
    We are even able to disappoint ourselves too but this is the one thing we can do something about and where we can start.

    It all begins with One before it goes on with two and more.

    Wish you well Oxy.

    Love from me
    mudra

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    Re: The Dangers of Wrong Meditation Practices

    Post  mudra on Tue Aug 12, 2014 1:45 pm

    Sanicle wrote:
    mudra wrote:That thing hits you in the Heart and you know grace has opened up for you and you enter there with heart and soul. One could say Heart and soul bring you to that threshold. Its inspiration guiding you , the compass of Know/Now and it  transforms your perceptions with great love , no harm.

    I agree with you Mudra and I'm not saying here that meditation is something we shouldn't do.  I followed my heart in meditating and doing so made my life far, far richer than I'm sure it would have been otherwise.  The lessons I learned about myself were more emphatically bought home to me by delving into this rich landscape and meeting the beings I did there and thus doing things to learn the truth of them that can't be done here.  I do not regret any of it.  Far from it.  

    And now not meditating has taught me something else about life in these bodies of ours that I probably wouldn't have discovered otherwise.........just how powerfully it can effect us in ways that we are generally not made aware of by those in this 'business'.  And I truly think these warnings need to be taken heed of so that people can make more discerning decisions than I, for one, made when I began the practice.  You could almost say that being aware of these effects just go to prove how powerful the practice truly is.  I love you 

    Well my friend I have absolutely no doubt that whatever you do is moved by a call of Heart and that from this your learning is an enriching and inspiring experience.

    I find it difficult to discuss the subject of meditation as such because I see it not as something that needs a special space or time and a particular exercise to do but rather as something that becomes part of life itself in all its facets.

    I have'nt practised so many different techniques nor did I follow exact steps by the book when I found myself adventuring in one. I rather quickly made it my own thing discarding what I didn't find fit and embracing what felt right for me.

    So I am really not learned as you are on the pittfalls these various techniques may have . I probably avoided them .
    I appreciate however you bring the subject up as it may help others to learn to discern better . That's a very good thing sister.

    Much for You
    mudra
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    orthodoxymoron

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    Re: The Dangers of Wrong Meditation Practices

    Post  orthodoxymoron on Tue Aug 12, 2014 2:51 pm





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    mudra

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    Re: The Dangers of Wrong Meditation Practices

    Post  mudra on Tue Aug 12, 2014 4:10 pm

    You have that great wish to understand it all Oxy.
    Your Heart will take you there my friend.
    If not now a bit later for it is the greatest wish there could possibly be.

    Much Love from me
    mudra
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    orthodoxymoron

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    Re: The Dangers of Wrong Meditation Practices

    Post  orthodoxymoron on Wed Aug 13, 2014 12:17 am

    Thank-you Mudra and Brook (of Egypt?). I have learned a HUGE amount from both of you -- and I plan to learn MUCH more as I follow your posts and threads -- your past work on the old Project Avalon (and right here in the Mists). Please remember that a lot of my work has been an act. I'm not like this in 'real-life'. Not even close. Also -- when I view posts and links, I often just absorb the material, and move on without comment. Also, I often gain a tangential-insight which motivates me to post a seemingly unrelated comment. I have been modeling certain theories and personalities -- and I have attempted to maintain a certain continuity and consistency -- which often makes it seem as if I am unappreciative and close-minded. Just the fact that I chose Project Avalon and The Mists of Avalon is an indication of open-mindedness (rather than being a rebellion against Judeo-Christianity). This whole thing has been (and continues to be) a test for all-concerned -- and I truly wish for things to work out well for all-concerned -- even though I have been (and will continue to be) somewhat questioning and contrarian toward all-concerned. I generally end-up making all-concerned angry (in one way or another) -- but I have been (and will continue to be) an Equal-Opportunity Pain in Uranus. Namaste.
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    Sanicle

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    Re: The Dangers of Wrong Meditation Practices

    Post  Sanicle on Wed Aug 13, 2014 6:31 am

    I feel it’s necessary to clarify that this thread was begun to make readers aware of the potential problems that can occur in our physical (in particular), emotional and mental bodies, due to practising meditation………….dangers which are not often spelled out by those who recommend the practice and, as such, many seem unaware of, as was I. The thread is NOT intended to delve into what (or who) may come through to us from other sources from participating in any of the various forms of this practise. There are plenty of threads and info on the net that discuss this already.

    I’ve added this clarification in the first post.  I love you 
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    Brook

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    Re: The Dangers of Wrong Meditation Practices

    Post  Brook on Wed Aug 13, 2014 7:30 am

    Sanicle wrote:This thread was begun to make readers aware of the potential problems that can occur in our physical (in particular), emotional and mental bodies, due to practicing meditation………….dangers which are not often spelled out by those who recommend the practice and, as such, many seem unaware of, as was I.  The thread is NOT intended to delve into what (or who) may come through to us from other sources from participating in any of the various forms of this practice.  There are plenty of threads and info on the net that discuss this already.


    I've started this thread because reading the material I'm going to post links to have given an answer to why a health issue I've had for years now - that of vertigo or dizziness - has suddenly disappeared, so naturally I'm hoping this information I've found may help others with this or other problems that are listed below that can occur from wrong meditation practices.  You see I stopped meditating for some weeks and vaguely noticed that I hadn't been having so many dizzy spells, but the other night I did a healing meditation for another health issue I've developed.  During this meditation I suddenly had quite a strong episode of vertigo again so it was easy enough to put two and two together.  I got googling and came up with not only the reason behind the most outward expression of the vertigo spells but further reading revealed the underlying issue that allowed that to occur.

    The first clue ...........
    It is very possible for a person to have such a good meditation that the physical body becomes disconnected for the astral-, mental-, or soul-level bodies. This is a common byproduct of meditation. If you feel dizzy, lightheaded, disconnected, or experience a rocking motion during or after meditation, you may have started the process of out-of-the-body travel.

    There are other problems listed at this website also, but they don't tell you how to 'fix' these issues.  Plus I don't see vertigo as a desirable effect of meditating, especially when it occurs when one in not meditating as well.  Read more here: http://www.dailyom.com/library/000/000/000000260.html

    Another website revealed why it is that I would have such a weak link between my physical and etheric bodies, the underlying cause.  I was already aware what I learned might be an issue but now I know it is.  You've probably guessed also .......... weak lower chakras, not well grounded.

    So that's my issue explained but there are further problems that can be experienced listed below.


       Dizziness or loss of balance
       Spontaneous urges to move or take unusual postures or positions
       Localized pain that begins and ends abruptly with no external cause
       Abrupt changes in heart rate, including tachycardia (rapid heart rate), and bradycardia (slow heart rate), and other kinds of heart arrhythmia
       Unusually abrupt and intense sexual sensations, pains, and urges
       Temporary blindness
       Uticaria and rashes
       Allergies
       Anxiety attacks
       Confusion
       Intense emotions, particularly intense emotional swings
       Psychotic symptoms, including ideation
       Spontaneous speeding and slowing of thoughts
       Spontaneous trance states, where awareness of external surroundings and conscious control are very limited
       Unwanted and uncontrolled paranormal experiences such as psychic or clairvoyant activity
       Suicidal and homicidal thoughts
       Urges to self-mutilate
       Inability to talk
       Difficulty concentrating
       Insomnia
       A sense of one’s own thoughts and emotions being foreign and invasive.

    As can be seen, some of these are far more serious.  The good thing is that a .pdf is attached that goes into more detail and also explain how these problems can be overcome.  I'm giving the link to the introduction page as the questions by readers and answers given below are well worth reading.  That link is: http://www.iam-u.org/index.php/how-to-avoid-the-dangers-of-meditation

    The link to the most helpful .pdf is http://iam-u.org/media/kundalini_syndrome.pdf   It is 25 pages long, but in reality it's more like 25 paragraphs as the pages are quite short.

    Hopefully someone out there will find this info as useful as I have.   I love you

    Okay, now I have a bit of time to respond.

    Many of the conditions listed in this post would be a residual from something other than meditation.  for example:   Suicidal and homicidal thoughts
      Urges to self-mutilate


    This may come out in a meditative practice from someone...however this is caused from a mental disturbance/unbalance and not the meditation.  In an instance such as this immediate attention should be required. and not the recommended advise of  some meditative practice such as listed from the pdf and their institute.

    Fact is this pdf is from a IAM University of the Heart and they should be required to advise ANYBODY with such symptoms to seek immediate attention.  I'm not even sure they're qualified to handle such cases.

    Here is their primary website:

    http://www.iam-u.org/About.html

    and this page I'm including:

    http://www.iam-u.org/HTPW.html

    The pdf listed is a bit of a sales job for their practice.

    Now on the dizzy and vertigo sympton you are experiencing.

    When I was in the Los Angeles area I had none of those symptoms.  But when I moved to North Carolina I briefly experienced this symptom.  Why?  Well I asked the question and the answer I got was "electronic interference".  To be sure there was far more of that in LA as opposed to NC.

    To over come the symptom I had to re-balance my energy focus.  If you're interested I'd be happy to tell you how but that is not the goal of this particular post.

    The primary interest I had in this post was the methods used to achieve good results as opposed to negative results.  

    Again I'm not certain the pdf venue that you're siting is qualified to do anything other than sell their own method of meditation.  I've not read the whole thing.  

    We all know however the practice is as ancient as dirt and over that time many different results for many different people is to be certain.

    Many of those symptoms as I suggest are symptoms of something "other than" from the practice itself.  So if those are the results one would experience I strongly suggest something other than meditation to alleviate that symptom...and Meditation probably would not be advised until it's reconciled.  Without actually reading and studying the methods of the IAM University PDF...I would say it's rather irresponsible for them to suggest anything other then to seek  immediate help AND ATTENTION on some of those serious conditions during meditation or any other time for that matter.


    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_crisis

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicidal_ideation

    About
    A 2-year program in heart-centered meditation and philosophy. Our mission is to share with you the tools which contribute to humanity's shift from mind to heart. Learn more at www.IAM-U.org
    Mission
    To share with you the tools which contribute to humanity's shift from mind to heart
    Company Overview
    The IAM University of the Heart is a 2-year program in heart-based meditation, founded by Puran and Susanna Bair, co-authors of "Living from the Heart" http://www.livingfromtheheart.com/ and "Energize Your Heart" http://www.energizeyourheart.com/ Unless otherwise noted, all the status updates for this page are written by Asatar Bair, President of the IAM University of the Heart. His page is http://www.facebook.com/asatar.bair


    Link from the pdf:

    https://www.facebook.com/IAM.University.of.the.Heart/info?ref=page_internal

    Do you think someone like Robin Williams would have been saved from an online and/or meditation course or retreat?



    I'd like to think the pain is gone and they're up there sharing a good laugh

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    Brook

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    Re: The Dangers of Wrong Meditation Practices

    Post  Brook on Wed Aug 13, 2014 10:49 am

    One last thing on the Vertigo.....

    Dopamine increases during meditation.

    The neurochemistry of vertigo includes six primary neurotransmitters that have been identified between the three-neuron arc that drives the vestibulo-ocular reflex.

    Dopamine may accelerate vestibular compensation.


    Causes and symptoms of Vertigo:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vertigo

    (Scroll to "Pathophysiology" in the veritgo wiki article)

    And most important...in the practice of meditation and vertigo in connection to Dopamine:

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11958969


    I found that after a few minutes research...imagine!

    Must be the coffee  Huh ? 

     Brook


    Don't forget to ground! 
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    Sanicle

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    Re: The Dangers of Wrong Meditation Practices

    Post  Sanicle on Wed Aug 13, 2014 1:59 pm

    Yes, imagine that. Must be magical coffee you drink Brook. I wonder what you would do without it sometimes.   Razz  

    Seems that overall you agree with me then that meditating can exacerbate underlying imbalances in our beings that we are unaware of and therefore should not be promoted for one and all to use willy-nilly as if often done currently.

    Oh and by the way, I hope no-one else thinks I was promoting the IAm website or group (or any other) in posting that particular piece of info from them. I was merely using it, as I did further posts, as examples to show that it is a known fact in meditation circles that there can be unexpected consequences from meditating that are not generally exposed to the public. I do, however, applaud them for speaking of this, even though they are probably doing it to make money. It's the information I was interested in revealing here primarily to give warning and make my point.

    And "yes please" Brook, I would be interested in hearing how you overcame the vertigo you experienced that time. Even though I've had no further instances of it as I'm not currently meditating, it may start up again for all I know. And it may help someone else who may be reading this thread that has the problem. Thanks.  I love you 
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    mudra

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    Re: The Dangers of Wrong Meditation Practices

    Post  mudra on Wed Aug 13, 2014 3:39 pm

    Sanicle wrote:I feel it’s necessary to clarify that this thread was begun to make readers aware of the potential problems that can occur in our physical (in particular), emotional and mental bodies, due to practising meditation………….dangers which are not often spelled out by those who recommend the practice and, as such, many seem unaware of, as was I.  The thread is NOT intended to delve into what (or who) may come through to us from other sources from participating in any of the various forms of this practise.  There are plenty of threads and info on the net that discuss this already.

    I’ve added this clarification in the first post.  I love you 

    My bad I realize now I misinterpreted the title of your thread Sanicle as having to do with  "the dangers of wrongly praticing meditation "which then evolved as the discussion was taking place to having to do with  " wrong meditation techniques " . Both interpretations obviously did'nt have anything to do with what you really meant. I should have read you much more carefully my friend. Apologies for this.

    Much Love for You
    mudra
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    orthodoxymoron

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    Re: The Dangers of Wrong Meditation Practices

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